SPEAKER_01 0:00

Hi everyone, welcome to another episode of Beyond the Case. This is a podcast where global leaders from Harvard Business School's OPM community join in a personal capacity to share the real decisions, life lessons, mental models which go behind building enduring companies. Sucharita Basu is my guest today. She's with me in OPM67, one of the most successful lawyers in India. Sucharita, it's a pleasure to have you.

SPEAKER_00 0:26

Thank you, Sohin. Thank you so much. And thank you for doing this, actually. It's really a very commendable endeavor. Thank you.

SPEAKER_01 0:32

Sucharita, do you want to take a moment to give everyone a background on yourself and introduce your as well?

SPEAKER_00 0:39

Certainly, certainly. So as uh Sohin has said, I have been his uh batchmate in the HBS OPM unit 67, and uh it was uh really the way um that that course went, and it's still we still have two more units to uh two more modules, I think they call it, right? To finish. By the end of it, I'm sure we'll be completely changed. We have changed 30%, 33%, I'm sure we'll change 100% by the end of it. And as far as I am concerned, I'm uh a a legal professional, I'm a lawyer by profession, and uh I have my own law firm uh called Aquilaw, and it is about uh 10 years that we have uh actually we've just completed 10 years of Aquilaw, founding Aquilaw. And um uh I have uh done uh several kinds of uh you know legal practices. I started with litigation, then I did corporate commercial, then I did some cap markets. At that point of time, it was not so siloed as it is today in terms of legal practice. So good thing I did because today I'm a very, very robust generalist and I can lead a law firm with different uh kinds of practices. And uh now my role is mostly I'm the managing partner of Aquila, and my role is of course I st I still do and I still supervise a lot of strategy and execution, uh especially promoter advisory and transaction advisory. But I also do a lot of business development, networking, and I've spread myself very thin in terms of traveling, learning, etc. So that's me really in a few lines.

SPEAKER_01 2:10

You spoke about business development, so I'm tempted to get this question in. Do you think sales comes naturally to lawyers selling skills?

SPEAKER_00 2:17

You know, I read somewhere that at some stage every professional becomes a salesperson. So uh it's good to be obviously at the uh at a juncture where you're learning and you're executing because without that skill set, without that knowledge, you'll not be able to sell. But especially in a in a role which I have today, or many even in law firms, you know, in in other law firms, even my partners, some of them are certainly expected to do business development. So that is a skill that they have to empower themselves with, they have to educate themselves with. Some of it does come naturally. For me, it comes very naturally because I'm a social person, and then the rest of them they will have to learn. And those who cannot learn, they also do business development, you know, but they do a more passive type where they get work because of the good work that they've done. So it's more organic and it's probably slower, but um that's also a kind of business development because it is a matter of trust, it's a matter of building repetition for professionals.

SPEAKER_01 3:16

Great, thank you. Okay, going back to you and uh your background, you grew up in a family uh of practicing lawyers, is that correct?

SPEAKER_00 3:24

Yes. Yes.

SPEAKER_01 3:25

Can you talk a little bit about your early childhood and what influence that had, you know, seeing the kind of conference that you had at home?

SPEAKER_00 3:33

So I I am a fourth generation lawyer actually, and legal profession, and also I think medical profession. Many professions they are very generational. Not that it's the case with everybody, but for me it was. And um my childhood was simple. It was happy, it was simple. I did not have a lot of struggles in my childhood. It was protected, like how any other, you know, uh we we were a family of four, my parents, my brother, and me. And uh I was a decent student. Like any Bengali households, you'll realize that all all children are exposed to art, music, etc. So was I. I can't say I have an exceptional talent in any one of them, but they have that learning, that that uh training has certainly shaped my aesthetics. But uh when I came into in class 11, 12, I did have a sort of wake-up moment where I realized that no, I have to do really well now. And I did fairly well in my uh class 12 codes, but then I got into law school, which was again a very simple um uh process then. And uh that's how it is, that's how it is. So I I have a lot of beautiful memories about my childhood. I'm very fond of them and I cherish them, and that has kept the child in me also alive, which I enjoy. I go back to it many times.

SPEAKER_01 4:44

Did you always know that you were gonna uh accept the legal profession which was in your veins and was being passed down generationally, or did you initially have some other ideas on which way your life might shape out?

SPEAKER_00 4:56

Not really. And from grade eight, more or less, I had decided that I would uh study law because we had our own law firm and uh my father was leading it then. It belonged to my great-grandfather, then came to my grandfather, then to my father. So it was not by accident uh choosing legal profession, it was by design. But you know what happened was um was destiny had its own plans because when I was in my first year, I did a five-year law course right after school. So when I was in my first year, my and I was like totally ready to uh train and be an apprentice uh under my father and in that firm, my father got diagnosed with uh brain cancer. So it was like a stage four uh malignancy and point of no return. So I I was 18 then, barely, and my brother was in the US and he had just finished his education and got his first job, maybe. And like I like I said, my childhood was very secure, it was protected childhood. So that really broke down like a house of cards and overnight. And um, we were all hit by this catastrophe, and um, especially I was left a little bit um uh confused and clueless about my career path and my life ahead because I didn't know then what to do, because I was completely everybody knew that I'm going to, you know, uh train under my dad and then run the firm one day. So all that was washed away in uh in 24 hours. But it is also true that uh, you know, when God closes one door, opens several, gives several opportunities. And uh then I got this um sort of a started training in in a very large law firm. And and that, you know, those days were very, very um I mean it was shocking, it was sad, but I I mean that space where my father's firm was that was that was rented from uh this larger law firm which had that building. So and uh out of nowhere, you know, we we uh uh the the senior partner who was there and when he realized perhaps that I was studying law, he said then why don't you start with us? And that was such an opportunity then, though I was not ready to go into regular working. I was only 18, I was going to college and coming back home. But then I thought this is this is it. I mean, this is the best thing that can happen today because in this profession you need training, you need mentoring. You can't, and the more training, the more mentoring you have, then obviously you're better, right? And so then I started working when I was 18. It was like a full-time work. I was training with them. I did used to do college in the morning, then I used to take a bus and come to uh office, but it was very difficult for me to navigate, you know. And uh, because at home I was seeing this my father figure. Imagine you're also a dad, you have a daughter, and um, kind of father figure is that he's an intelligent man, he's a capable man, he's confident, he's fending for us, and suddenly I see that this man is becoming weak and sick and deteriorating every day, right? In front of my eyes, I'm seeing him perishing. And then I'm uh coming into this new environment totally, which I thought would be like my own environment, but it's not. It was full of strangers, full of old elder people, experienced people, and I was perhaps the youngest for for a few years in that law firm, right? But I didn't even know how to take a public transport, honestly. I knew, but not like a crowded and a crowded bus of the office time, you know how Indian cities are. And um, I used to walk back home sometimes because I didn't know how to uh manage in that crowded bus. So um that's how it was. Those were a few years of uh navigation. I I I started in that law firm as an intern, as a trainee, and uh when I moved out, I was a partner. I I was there for about 19 years, almost two decades over there, and all my training, all my learning has been there. So I'm very, very grateful to the mentoring, to the leadership that I received over there. And uh a lot of it, I mean, uh obviously we I have learned a lot of things. I have unlearned also a lot of things because of progression of time and thought processes, but a lot of it has I played it through the through the hardships also really, you know, what I had to face then and then which I uh survived through and today we are thriving. So that's a little story about my background. You know, the the the uh the uh uh a work of fate is that when I started my uh career in that larger law firm, the space where I started, I walked into as a nervous young girl, that is the space where my first office is now. So, you know, I used to get a stipend of 5,000 rupees, which is like$50 over there, and today I sit here and sign checks of millions, which is you know, and every time I thank God that look at what you've done for me.

SPEAKER_01 9:39

Very, very inspiring. So, at what point did you, after working 19 years, you know, what made you start your own firm? What was the inspiration or motivation behind that?

SPEAKER_00 9:50

So I think it was a very natural transition, you know, because uh it it is between Sanjay and I that we founded, co-founded the firm. And both of us are ambitious people, both of us uh have spent 20 years in the profession. We've been trained by the best, and we uh realized that we are very well networked also by then. And then we thought that why not start on our own? And somewhere maybe I had the annoying feeling that I had my own law firm and I had to give it up because of circumstances. So maybe why not start on our own? And uh apart from that, we also did it was a practical call as well, and we did some market landscape study in the sense that we realized that uh especially in Calcutta, most of the law firms they are either very large and legacy law firms, or they are um mid-level but legacy, or they are uh sole proprietorship. Very few, I mean not even one perhaps was a mid-tire, sophisticated young law firm. So that's the space which we thought that can be filled, you know. It's unmet needs, like we call it now. And so uh that's how we started, that's how we aspired Aquilaw to be. That it would be a modern contemporary law firm. It will have uh younger people, we will not have legacy baggage, but at the same time we have uh 20 years of training behind us, so it's not a new law firm being started by freshers. So uh that's that's where therefore we took the shot, as as Professor Lahonwood put it, and we got this nice space also where which I said that so it that was also uh we were not getting a space, and one day when I was coming into this uh road, I thought that why don't we try in this building? So we realized that this building, this space had just been vacated by the debt recovery appellate trapment. So their bench, etc sector, was still there, and so we hired this space. In fact, the landlord who was giving us that space, they they thought that he thought that suddenly why these two young people are coming for this reasonably large space, but then he took references, he took, you know, he did his own homework and then finally we got the space. So that's how we began. And so we did it out of love and hope and uh love for the profession for sure. I wanted to create a legacy of my own and hope, and it's been a thrilling ten years and many more ahead, I'm assuming.

SPEAKER_01 12:01

You referenced Sanjay. Is that also your yes?

SPEAKER_00 12:04

Sanjay is my husband. We both used to work in Khirtan. And uh, but we always had different uh practice areas. Therefore, we thought let us start it because we had two different practice areas, it would help, you know, in having both the kind of um verticals in the in in the law firm.

SPEAKER_01 12:20

You already tempted to maybe do it one at a time, you know, like hey, you keep your job so we have some income from the.

SPEAKER_00 12:25

I know, I know. We we were we were considering that, and a lot of people did advise us that, and a lot of people also said that look, uh the eastern part of the country is a it's it's slow commercially, etc. But again, we were um we were confident, we relied upon our guts also, and uh we thought uh it is better that we support each other rather than you know uh uh together rather than uh one person being uh independent. And then we wanted this again this this vision of a mid-level sophisticated law firm where two, three kinds of practices uh can be brought together. Okay, and now we have many more, but at that point of time we had about these. And we always knew that we'll have a firm which is today. We are we started like two of us started. There was one more lady who later uh very quickly uh left and wanted to do on her own. Today we are about 150 and uh we are in four cities, we are 16 partners. So that's the kind of vision we always had. It was never supposed to be a Basuan company, which is why you know there's a little story behind the name also, because the name which is Aquilaw, a lot of people ask me, it's a great conversation started as well because you know at 4:30 a.m. I was then I used to be always worried. I'm still worried all the time. I'm still you know anxious, but then I used to be always worried because we are starting on our own, and I started looking for names, and I thought, let me start looking for names of a constellation. And I wanted a name with an A. So then I came across this name, and I was scrolling on my phone at 4:30 a.m. in the morning, like that Brahma Murta as you call it, and then I came across this name called Aquila, which is a constellation of stars. It also means uh eagle in Greek, and it also means uh we have we are followers of Lord Vishnu, so it also means Garuda. So then I just added a W. So it became Aquilaw, and the philosophy behind it was that I knew that we'll be all laterals and you know, and we'll be all stars in our own capacities, and we'll come together and make this beautiful bright constellation. Very nice. So that's how Aquilaw uh came into existence.

SPEAKER_01 14:23

Can you share with us some of the most important lessons that you learned starting and growing this form, especially in the leadership space, right? Any leadership?

SPEAKER_00 14:32

So there has been plenty, you know, and as um and plenty trial and errors, etc. But as as as the professors in Harvard puts it, that they are not no mistakes, they are all learnings. So actually they are so. So one illustration I can give you is that we I was in a jet ski, right? Trying to uh to uh garner clients, trying to deliver um work, extraordinary quality work within neck, break, speed, so that people realize uh that the these uh uh uh people are really good, they don't sit over work, etc. So that takes a lot of energy and time. So what I realized was after a few years, during our fifth year, and then a lot of people had already joined us, I realized that we were losing one or two good resources. Uh more than one or two. And the reason was that we did not have the time to listen to them. They uh could be freshers, they could be uh laterals, they could be mid-level, whatever it is, they also had something to contribute, whether it is a leadership problem with their immediate seniors or whether they are lacking resources to deliver properly. So that's when I sort of halted. I paused a little bit and I started doing this soul searching, and we've always had this HR lady with us from day one, and she's really very good. So both she and I started, you know, uh deliberating on this. And what where are we going wrong? So we realized that we need to listen to them and we need to have a more structured appraisal process, feedback mechanism, etc. Which is why we at that point of time we engaged an external consultant and then we uh put all these processes in place. We had KPIs, KRAs, etc. We had different kinds of knowledge sessions and we pulled that. So now we are obviously now we have to have far more robust HR team. We have HR, all our officers led by um a very, very strong person. So that is one learning which because for us, for lawyers, for a law firm, people are the most important resource. It's not there is no other raw material, right? So I can't but not be people-centric, and that's when I realized that as a law firm, one differentiator for us is to be people-centric.

SPEAKER_01 16:39

You spoke about KPIs and KRAs. I've not often come across law firms using metrics. Yeah. Um, I would be very curious to understand what does your KPI dashboard look like? What metrics, and don't give away your secret source, but what are some of the high-level metrics that are.

SPEAKER_00 16:55

High-level metrics would be more or less uh more or less what any other law firm today, law firms are quite professional. So more or less what others would have. Obviously, first is absolutely top-notch skill and knowledge, delivery of work, how timely delivery of work, neatness, completeness of work. Then this whole thing about team building, getting good talents, nurturing them towards leadership, you know, giving them exposure as well, and then making them stick around and making them also have this ownership towards the firm. These are certain things, you know, we we were discussing about managers in one of the project procession I think. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 17:33

That's what came to my mind right now.

SPEAKER_00 17:35

Yeah, so so those are the things that obviously are among KPIs. Then we have other things as well, which is of course one is business development for the senior level partners for sure. Then uh business development would also entail like speaking at different panels, events, uh writing articles, making yourself visible, creating your own brand along with creating the brand, building the brand of the organization. Then um what else? Obviously, financial targets. So these are the broad level KPIs, but a lot of work has to go into it, including teamwork, for it to be achieved.

SPEAKER_01 18:10

How has how has your particular role evolved over the last 11 years of starting and running active?

SPEAKER_00 18:15

So yeah. So when I started, of course, I used to do a lot of execution as well. So gradually I have I don't have time now to do a lot of execution, but I like to, and for instance, I'll give you one example. Say in my real estate team, my real estate partner, I have three now, and they are working on a certain project. They will they will do everything and at some strategy level they will come and discuss with me. And I like to at least know what's going on in every matter because often clients call me. So I like to know which stage they are in of completion, what milestone has been fulfilled, if there is a roadblock, then what it is, if I can help them or not. So that way I am quite hands-on. And um the other thing which has evolved for me is my role as the managing partner because I'm I'm very, very hands-on and I'm completely, completely into the thick of things. And that has been further reinforced by the case studies where we studied that you cannot but be hands-on, you have to get into operations, you have to get into finance control, and all of it. I have my space over there as well. And the other thing which, you know, over the years, what has happened is also I have started interacting a lot with the government and the industry. So that is something very unique actually. And uh in 23-24, I also became the chairperson for CII West Bengal State Council. So it is very rare that uh uh that somebody from the service sector and that too, um, not like somebody like a uh a very large consulting firm, but a relatively new service sector person, that to a woman, etc., will be in that leadership role. But that also I took a lot of interest from day one. Like when I started 10 years back and then gradually I got into the leadership, and I really enjoy doing this. And I feel that it is not only CIA is not only a platform for, you know, for for um like for the industry or the government, etc., but it's also a way of giving back, you know, because there's so much policy advocacy that we do through that platform. It's quite interesting actually. So that is another role that I have developed and I enjoy actually. Even now there's so much conversation which I'm doing about ease of doing business, and that could be anything, right? There are so many parameters of ease of doing business in this country. Yeah. So that's how my role has evolved. And today I travel a lot, I meet a lot of people, and of course I but then I'm I'm very rooted. So I mean I'm very, very rooted with everyday uh work.

SPEAKER_01 20:31

You s you referenced uh being a woman leader and the chairperson of CII. So I think it's a good transition into this next question I've been meaning to ask, which is about wearing multiple hats, you know, as an entrepreneur, a lawyer, parent, being a mother, right? While doing all of this. In India, uh women are expected to fit into many different roles, uh, which is a fact, you know. Doesn't matter how much we've progressed and how modern the mindset might get, women do end up bearing more responsibilities than men. How have you navigated through all of these different responsibilities given everything that you've spoken about till now in your journey and where you've landed today?

SPEAKER_00 21:07

So, you know, one thing which I've learned very early on is to build very strong teams. So at home front, also I have a very strong team and office also. So this support system is really my lifeline, honestly. Because actually I wear multiple hats. Of course, this Aquila is a huge, huge responsibility which I try to fulfill. I'm in the board of uh uh listed companies. I do a lot of reading and writing myself. Then this HBS thing that also is quite time consuming, right? And um and and of course my son. Now the thing is that, and you know, when my um parents are a great support in India, that is one uh good part about being in India and being able to and trying to work because parents become huge support, both in laws and parents. And I have read in a book of Nadal Al Kidwai, which is one of my favorite books, actually, Thirty Women in Power, and one of them have said that we Always very nice to your mother-in-law. So, you know. So I say that my only mother-in-law, you should be very nice to your entire support system and not, you know, try to get into the realm which others are enjoying. And honestly, for in my case, at my junior stage as a lawyer, when I got married, I used to have crazy hours like any other junior lawyer would, right? I used to come back home at 2, 3 in the night after finishing all my deadlines. There used to be deals which used to go on for months, and I did not have to sew and even fold my clothes. You know, my mom-in-law was so sweet and so cooperative. But if I would be, you know, on her all the time, perhaps not, right? So it is better that you keep your you know objective straight, what you want to do, and um then try to navigate. So, and you know, I have always been a very curious person. You must have seen in the HBS class also that uh I love doing collateral thinking, it I love thinking out of the box, and uh, and but at the same time, I also keep my mind open to other people's perspectives. So I've learned a lot and I jump at every opportunity, and I truly enjoy it, I'm sure that I enjoy it. So that's one thing which has kept me going and in navigating all these roles. So I don't want to let go of anything, which is why I try to create a good support system. Now, as far as motherhood is concerned, that is something which I really wanted. I really wanted to become a mother, and I'm uh very happy that uh my son today is uh 16 year old. He studies in a boarding school, so that way I don't have to be uh completely involved every day with him till class seven, he was eight he was with me. Uh then I used to be very hands-on, but now of course he is very independent. But I do enjoy uh whatever time I get with him during his holidays. I we love taking holidays together, we love reading together, we write articles together, uh we even watch pro wrestling and uh concerts we go to together, we build daggers together. I have a beautiful bond with him, and uh I really enjoy motherhood.

SPEAKER_01 23:57

Very nice to be here. Your firm has grown to 115 uh team members, you mentioned. How do you think that is gonna change in the coming years now that AI has come into the picture? I will Felipe is another lawyer in our OPM cohort and uh in our living group chat, he mentioned something two or three days ago where he said Claude can easily do the work of a junior level associate. Maybe not, you know, a senior level. I think he mentioned it's a couple hours that Claude takes to do something which should take someone else days to do. I'm just wondering, you know, what your experience has been like using AI as an attorney. How you see that changing the quantity of workforce needed to run a responsible and successful law firm. Uh and is that different in India compared to the rest of the world?

SPEAKER_00 24:45

No, so you know, I have been talking about this AI with many lawyers globally. Um it is uh I won't say anybody is in a very matured stage of using AI, like completely matured, they've done away with the entire workforce. Certain things can be done for sure, and junior level um uh uh things can certainly be done by AI at a much more faster and uh more efficient, accurate, and cheaper way. So young lawyers will have to be certainly very careful. And uh, today in India uh there are so many law schools, right? And there are so many lawyers graduating every year. So only those will perhaps be able to survive who will be innately brainy, intelligent people, and they will know how to use that AI to their advantage. Globally, also it is a but then at the same time, clients will also expect, right? That uh why will we uh uh why will we take it uh such a slow delivery when AI is doing it for other firms, which will be much faster. So AI is the reality, you have to adopt it. Certain uh jobs will have to be sort of um, what do I say, will have to be molded around it. Uh but lawyers who are really uh interested in law and they are smart uh children, they are going to stay.

SPEAKER_01 25:58

But you know, they have to be very, very robust in terms of it just can't be very easy and um plugging into Philippe again, you know, I asked him this question because he's the only other attorney I have interviewed on this show. I asked him, what do you think makes a good lawyer? And he had his own version. I'm wondering what what you think of that. Yes, yes, yes.

SPEAKER_00 26:17

So um I have also spent some time with Philippe and more or less we are of we are of the same background, you know. He used to be also in a larger law firm and then he made his own 10 years back, and he's also doing very well. I've met his partners as well. Um so for uh if I if I have to, you know, tell uh I mean I will speak a little bit in um uh Hindi or Urdu, I don't know what that language is. It is Urdu, I think he, and I've always believed it. This this that every young person should strive for this. That I'll tell you the four lines. It it goes like this, you know, this this sums up this whole thing that you have to make yourself so solid in terms of skill, in terms of knowledge, in terms of personality, appearance, exposure, all of that, so that there cannot be any opportunity which can be denied for you. And even God will ask you before writing your destiny that you tell me what you want. That that's the message that even I tell my son that these are formative years and you have to make yourself really, really solid so that you cannot be ignored. This is something which I always tell my young lawyers also that be be absolutely state of the art. Don't be a all-size uh milta heb medium excel large. Don't be that, be handcrafted sabhya sachi.

SPEAKER_01 27:40

If you could speak to a younger version of yourself, yeah, what advice would you give her today?

SPEAKER_00 27:44

See, I um younger version of myself, I would be that I did not have a foreign education because I did not circumstantially could or uh even financially. So that's another reason why I I chose to do the HBS OPM. Maybe I I I a younger version of me would be to certainly strive to do a foreign education, to get a foreign degree, get that exposure, and also travel more and explore a little more. That thing I would certainly, if I could go back 20 years, I would do that. And uh otherwise I think my young version would be sort of proud of me for what I've been able to do despite not being in the best circumstances then.

SPEAKER_01 28:21

You referenced that you like reading a lot. You mentioned a book as well. Wondering if there's any other book that you want to talk about which might have influenced the way you think about life and leadership.

SPEAKER_00 28:30

Yeah, I read a lot really, honestly. But the two books which are very practical, which are not recently read, but read in the uh last four or five years. One is this Nenalal Kidvai's 30 women in power, because they are taking case studies on these women, as we took case studies, real-life case studies and HBS, they're taking case studies of these women, how they have uh, you know, navigated into leadership in different sectors. Also, that's a good book to read. The other is Indra Nui's book, My Life in Full Work, Family and Our Future. That's also a very good book. Initially, I thought I'll not read it, but then when I started reading it, I couldn't put it back. You know, it was it's a very beautiful book actually, and very practical. And not only women, even men should read that book.

SPEAKER_01 29:08

Yeah. What made you consider the OPM program at Howard Business School?

SPEAKER_00 29:12

So one reason is so in that I did not have a foreign education and I always uh looked forward to one. And considering the busyness that we have, this this the course content and the course duration of basically it's in like three weeks every year for three years, that sounded doable. The other thing is that because I'm helming an organization, and um I thought a little bit of structured training and learning about leadership, about operations, strategy, crisis leadership, finance control, all that we learn when I check the course content. I thought this is great. You know, this is what I need to learn in order to assimilate that, imbibe that, and perhaps putting it into the organization, which is at a growth stage, right? We are at a growth stage now. So it was a very, very important decision for me to take then. And I'm really glad that I did that. And today, you know, it was so immersive, so transformative for us, right? And I I know OPMers who who will tell that after the third uh module you're going to be a completely changed person. So, you know, these these learnings are edged in today in my mind, at least say, for instance, a Toyota, where they talk about operational excellence, an Obiroy, which they talk about customer happiness, anticipatory service, etc. Professor Das's how to make your customer a hero, for instance, and then Rob Parsons, for instance, you know, for for person like me who again are dealing with people, how to give feedback, when to give feedback, how to be a good leader. And also Professor Anandraman's that beautiful integrative lecture which he gave. I think that that is one of the few, I mean, if not the most wise words that I've heard in my life till now, honestly. And it has, I've really carried it back uh, and I think about it every day, how it is to take the shot and to enable others to take the shot. How to do, how to navigate life and a profession just by way of love and hope. Great.

SPEAKER_01 31:03

Sucharita, what a beautiful conversation. Thank you very much. Uh yeah, really appreciate you being here.

SPEAKER_00 31:09

Yeah. Same here, same here. I'm very glad that we could do it. And um but before I leave, I want to, you know, uh share for all of us, I mean, all of us at OPM sixty seven. Again, it's um these are four lines of uh Urdu that you know what we have done till now is just achieved a little bit, maybe. So I feel that Abhito Napi hai mutib her zameen hamni, abhito asman baki hai.

SPEAKER_01 31:34

Very good.

SPEAKER_00 31:35

So it really means that you know we have to do so much more. I mean and I hope that HBS and all of us together can achieve it.

SPEAKER_01 31:45

Thank you, Switchita. Very, very beautiful words. What a great way to end the episode.

SPEAKER_00 31:49

Thank you, Sunir. Bye bye. Take care.